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	<title>Comments on: Did prediction markets miss the call on Chicago&#8217;s Olympic bid?</title>
	<atom:link href="http://knowledgeproblem.com/2009/10/06/did-prediction-markets-miss-chicagos-olympic-chance/feed/" rel="self" type="application/rss+xml" />
	<link>http://knowledgeproblem.com/2009/10/06/did-prediction-markets-miss-chicagos-olympic-chance/</link>
	<description>Commentary on Economics, Information and Human Action</description>
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		<title>By: Michael Giberson</title>
		<link>http://knowledgeproblem.com/2009/10/06/did-prediction-markets-miss-chicagos-olympic-chance/#comment-9664</link>
		<dc:creator><![CDATA[Michael Giberson]]></dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Thu, 08 Oct 2009 02:24:46 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://knowledgeproblem.com/?p=5581#comment-9664</guid>
		<description><![CDATA[Re: &quot;we just don’t know enough about all this&quot;

I agree that &quot;we just don’t know enough about all this to make accurate assessments,&quot; and so I hope the prediction markets keep offering these kinds of contracts and we have a chance to learn.]]></description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Re: &#8220;we just don’t know enough about all this&#8221;</p>
<p>I agree that &#8220;we just don’t know enough about all this to make accurate assessments,&#8221; and so I hope the prediction markets keep offering these kinds of contracts and we have a chance to learn.</p>
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		<title>By: Jed Christiansen</title>
		<link>http://knowledgeproblem.com/2009/10/06/did-prediction-markets-miss-chicagos-olympic-chance/#comment-9663</link>
		<dc:creator><![CDATA[Jed Christiansen]]></dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Thu, 08 Oct 2009 01:38:10 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://knowledgeproblem.com/?p=5581#comment-9663</guid>
		<description><![CDATA[Mike: There is most definitely a spectrum.  Nobel prizes are far to the side that are almost totally inscrutable.  IOC and Supreme Court nominations somewhere less so.

As you mentioned, a shortlist helps, a larger voting pool helps, visibility in the process and criteria helps, and the potential for leaks helps.  Essentially we just don&#039;t know enough about all this to make accurate assessments.]]></description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Mike: There is most definitely a spectrum.  Nobel prizes are far to the side that are almost totally inscrutable.  IOC and Supreme Court nominations somewhere less so.</p>
<p>As you mentioned, a shortlist helps, a larger voting pool helps, visibility in the process and criteria helps, and the potential for leaks helps.  Essentially we just don&#8217;t know enough about all this to make accurate assessments.</p>
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		<title>By: Michael Giberson</title>
		<link>http://knowledgeproblem.com/2009/10/06/did-prediction-markets-miss-chicagos-olympic-chance/#comment-9659</link>
		<dc:creator><![CDATA[Michael Giberson]]></dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Wed, 07 Oct 2009 12:56:23 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://knowledgeproblem.com/?p=5581#comment-9659</guid>
		<description><![CDATA[Jed: So I take it you&#039;ll not be betting on the Nobel prize announcements, and I&#039;d have to agree that for Nobel prizes none of the betting houses or prediction markets are much use.  The potential numbers of answers is large and rather undefined - which of the thousands of writers will be selected for the literature prize? - unlike, maybe, the Booker prize with a shortlist to work with, the Nobel prizes are too open ended.

I&#039;m not convinced that IOC falls into this same category. The group is large and the membership is public - over 100 members from all over the world.  They are making a highly public and newsworthy decision, from an announced shortlist of possibilities.]]></description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Jed: So I take it you&#8217;ll not be betting on the Nobel prize announcements, and I&#8217;d have to agree that for Nobel prizes none of the betting houses or prediction markets are much use.  The potential numbers of answers is large and rather undefined &#8211; which of the thousands of writers will be selected for the literature prize? &#8211; unlike, maybe, the Booker prize with a shortlist to work with, the Nobel prizes are too open ended.</p>
<p>I&#8217;m not convinced that IOC falls into this same category. The group is large and the membership is public &#8211; over 100 members from all over the world.  They are making a highly public and newsworthy decision, from an announced shortlist of possibilities.</p>
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		<title>By: Jed Christiansen</title>
		<link>http://knowledgeproblem.com/2009/10/06/did-prediction-markets-miss-chicagos-olympic-chance/#comment-9656</link>
		<dc:creator><![CDATA[Jed Christiansen]]></dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Wed, 07 Oct 2009 01:15:37 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://knowledgeproblem.com/?p=5581#comment-9656</guid>
		<description><![CDATA[Hi, Mike.

I have to agree with you here, and particularly agree with the Sabernomics post.  It appears from the voting patterns that Rio and Chicago were the strongest competitors, which was reflected in the percentages.

However, I do agree with Chris that the overall quality of a prediction market where information and decisions are made in a close-hold group will likely be low.  I would include IOC voting, Supreme Court nominations (but not confirmations), cabinet secretary nominations (but not confirmations), etc.  As with all probabilistic markets we need more observations to properly evaluate success, and by their nature these types are few and far between.

Fundamentally, these markets are inherently risky.  But the market with a 45% chance of winning won.  So Chris is (once again) making a mountain out of a molehill to drive traffic.]]></description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Hi, Mike.</p>
<p>I have to agree with you here, and particularly agree with the Sabernomics post.  It appears from the voting patterns that Rio and Chicago were the strongest competitors, which was reflected in the percentages.</p>
<p>However, I do agree with Chris that the overall quality of a prediction market where information and decisions are made in a close-hold group will likely be low.  I would include IOC voting, Supreme Court nominations (but not confirmations), cabinet secretary nominations (but not confirmations), etc.  As with all probabilistic markets we need more observations to properly evaluate success, and by their nature these types are few and far between.</p>
<p>Fundamentally, these markets are inherently risky.  But the market with a 45% chance of winning won.  So Chris is (once again) making a mountain out of a molehill to drive traffic.</p>
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		<title>By: Fat Man</title>
		<link>http://knowledgeproblem.com/2009/10/06/did-prediction-markets-miss-chicagos-olympic-chance/#comment-9655</link>
		<dc:creator><![CDATA[Fat Man]]></dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Tue, 06 Oct 2009 21:31:01 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://knowledgeproblem.com/?p=5581#comment-9655</guid>
		<description><![CDATA[Maybe they really did gag on The One and his Consort.]]></description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Maybe they really did gag on The One and his Consort.</p>
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		<title>By: Michael Giberson</title>
		<link>http://knowledgeproblem.com/2009/10/06/did-prediction-markets-miss-chicagos-olympic-chance/#comment-9654</link>
		<dc:creator><![CDATA[Michael Giberson]]></dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Tue, 06 Oct 2009 19:49:10 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://knowledgeproblem.com/?p=5581#comment-9654</guid>
		<description><![CDATA[Amschel: I think it reasonable to believe that Toyko and Madrid were stuck at 1/4 of the voters max, making it impossible for either to win.  If Rio is eliminated in the first round instead of Chicago, the Rio votes likely go to Chicago and so Madrid or Toyko is eliminated.  Assume Tokyo eliminated as in actual second round.  The Toyko voters don&#039;t shift to Madrid, so Madrid is eliminated as in actual third round.  Chicago remains.

Speculative, sure, but some support in the voting record.

OneEyedMan: in principle you are right, but you can compare a series of markets against outcomes and if the prices are good, then things with prices around 10 should happen 10 percent of the time, etc.  Hard to judge with relatively few outcomes to judge against.]]></description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Amschel: I think it reasonable to believe that Toyko and Madrid were stuck at 1/4 of the voters max, making it impossible for either to win.  If Rio is eliminated in the first round instead of Chicago, the Rio votes likely go to Chicago and so Madrid or Toyko is eliminated.  Assume Tokyo eliminated as in actual second round.  The Toyko voters don&#8217;t shift to Madrid, so Madrid is eliminated as in actual third round.  Chicago remains.</p>
<p>Speculative, sure, but some support in the voting record.</p>
<p>OneEyedMan: in principle you are right, but you can compare a series of markets against outcomes and if the prices are good, then things with prices around 10 should happen 10 percent of the time, etc.  Hard to judge with relatively few outcomes to judge against.</p>
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	<item>
		<title>By: OneEyedMan</title>
		<link>http://knowledgeproblem.com/2009/10/06/did-prediction-markets-miss-chicagos-olympic-chance/#comment-9653</link>
		<dc:creator><![CDATA[OneEyedMan]]></dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Tue, 06 Oct 2009 16:02:40 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://knowledgeproblem.com/?p=5581#comment-9653</guid>
		<description><![CDATA[Seems like a fools errand to argue if the market some how got it wrong.  Even with risk neutral investors and an efficient market Madrid should have won 2% of the time. With unique events like this, how can you ever infer from ex-post outcomes what the proper ex-ante probabilities were.

Every time an option expires worthless that isn&#039;t an indictment of markets, that a recognition that something can have a positive price even if it has no value in many states of the world.]]></description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Seems like a fools errand to argue if the market some how got it wrong.  Even with risk neutral investors and an efficient market Madrid should have won 2% of the time. With unique events like this, how can you ever infer from ex-post outcomes what the proper ex-ante probabilities were.</p>
<p>Every time an option expires worthless that isn&#8217;t an indictment of markets, that a recognition that something can have a positive price even if it has no value in many states of the world.</p>
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	<item>
		<title>By: Amschel</title>
		<link>http://knowledgeproblem.com/2009/10/06/did-prediction-markets-miss-chicagos-olympic-chance/#comment-9652</link>
		<dc:creator><![CDATA[Amschel]]></dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Tue, 06 Oct 2009 14:24:42 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://knowledgeproblem.com/?p=5581#comment-9652</guid>
		<description><![CDATA[If it was a toss up between Chicago and Rio, why was Chicago eliminated first? even before Madrid and Tokyo?

Best Regards]]></description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>If it was a toss up between Chicago and Rio, why was Chicago eliminated first? even before Madrid and Tokyo?</p>
<p>Best Regards</p>
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		<title>By: &#124; Midas Oracle .ORG</title>
		<link>http://knowledgeproblem.com/2009/10/06/did-prediction-markets-miss-chicagos-olympic-chance/#comment-9651</link>
		<dc:creator><![CDATA[&#124; Midas Oracle .ORG]]></dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Tue, 06 Oct 2009 14:24:26 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://knowledgeproblem.com/?p=5581#comment-9651</guid>
		<description><![CDATA[[...] Prof Michael Giberson: [...]]]></description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>[...] Prof Michael Giberson: [...]</p>
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